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Episode #13
Nicholas Kusmich

How Nicholas Kusmich Leaped from a $30,000 Salary to a $2 Million Income Via Facebook: Podcast #13

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CSP 013 | Facebook Consulting

Nicholas started out as a pastor who was committed to not relying on his congregation for his salary. That commitment required a side hustle of some sort, which is when Nicholas turned to the internet marketing world. When he started using Facebook as a major advertising platform for his work, he quickly became one of the most recognized agencies/consulting businesses in the market. But that was just the beginning. You won’t want to miss the story of the million-dollar road that this side hustle has taken Nicholas down, on this episode of the Consulting Success Podcast.

Set yourself apart from the pack, protect your success, and pick clients you want to work with, all with the advice of Facebook ads expert Nicholas Kusmich.

I’m very excited to have Nicholas Kusmich join us. Nicholas, welcome. 

Michael, thank you. It’s an absolute pleasure to be here with you.

For those that don’t know you, Nicholas, give us a brief intro and explain what you do.

I got into the whole entrepreneurship game when I was seventeen years old. I witnessed my father had a heart attack when I was four. My father and my mother lost their business due to illness when I was seventeen. I was put in a position to try and figure this whole thing out. At that time, I was introduced to the internet marketing world and what it meant to use the internet to grow and build a business. One thing led to another. About six years ago or so, I stumbled across this platform called Facebook and realized that there could be some potential here. I dove two feet in to figure out Facebook as an advertising platform. Now several years later, we’re fortunate enough to have one of the most recognized agency/consultancy in the business. We get some fantastic results for our clients, and we’re able to work with some world changers doing so. That’s it in a nutshell.

How did you actually get into consulting? As you alluded to there and from what I know, you didn’t come into this with the typical corporate route. You were actually a pastor first, right?

Yeah. For fourteen years of my life, I was a pastor. I had my own church here in the Toronto area. I thought that’s what I was put on this planet to do. Yet at the side, while that was going on, it was important to me that A, I didn’t take a salary from the church or I took a very small one, and B, I was able to stay relevant as a pastor to my congregation. Meaning, I had a real job and I had to pay real bills and I had to go through real struggles. All the while of collecting a very small salary from the church and trying to stay relevant, I needed a side hustle to put food on the table, which is what I had to do.

That’s what really introduced me to the whole internet consulting/ agency world. I don’t know, be it the universe or right place at right time or whatnot, I got really good at it. I understood how to help people from a consulting standpoint and also from the agency standpoint. When it was time to transition out, it wasn’t as drastic of a transition as it might appear to be. I was doing some of this stuff on the side. I was just shifting, rather than having 20% of my attention there, it was now 80% to 90% to a 100% of my attention.

I don’t know if I’ve ever met before someone before who’s been a pastor and then also run an agency at the same time. What was going on in your mind? A lot of people just feel like they’re already overwhelmed with just trying to build their business or keep things moving forward. Here you are, doing two very different things. What was going on in your mind? How are you managing all of that?

They are different at the surface, but to me, I just saw them as supplementary from the fact that at that time, my heart’s passion and what I felt to be a calling was to serve my small congregation here in Toronto. The only way for me to do that to the best of my ability was to have a business that could support me to be able to do this, without having to worry about paying the bills or taking care of my family. I just didn’t want my congregation to think, “The money we spend to put towards the church is going towards this guy’s lifestyle.”I didn’t want that. I wanted to ensure that all the money that was being generated from the church stayed either within the church or went to causes that were worthwhile. The motivation or the ability to do that, I wish I could say was birthed out of a passion or this great work ethic or any of that, but at the end of the day it was necessity. I needed to take care of my family and I needed to take care of this congregation, and the only way for me to do that effectively was to have this business at that time on the side, that I could use to be able to do the rest of that, be a good family man and take care of my congregation effectively.

Why Facebook ads? Why not be a digital marketing consultant or online marketing consultant that can cover many areas of online marketing? What made you or had you choosing and landing on Facebook ads specifically? How did you get to that place? 

I started as a “digital marketing consultant.” I went to these events and I talked to people, and everybody and their mother was a digital marketing consultant. It didn’t allow me to stand out at all, for one. Secondly, call it being in the right place at the right time, but I had this experience where I was a “digital marketing consultant” with experience in Facebook ads. Now my assumption was that everybody had experience with Facebook ads and everybody was making it work, so I didn’t really see it as a selling point. I just saw it as a tool in everybody’s tool belt. I was particularly at a specific event and I had a life-changing experience. I was sitting there in the audience and the guy that got up on stage said, “How many people in this room use Facebook ads as part of their growth strategy for their business?”About 70% to 80%of the hands went up, including my own. The second question he asked was, “Of everybody who’s using this, how many people have found Facebook ads to be profitable?”Every single hand went down except mine.

That’s when I had that light bulb moment and without lightening striking or without any special hoopla, I made a mental decision sitting right there in that seat at that very moment that no longer would I be a “digital marketing consultant.”From this point forward, I would now focus my time, attention, and energy on Facebook ads. I noticed that I had a skill that could lend well to the industry and the marketplace, and it was an apparent need, a need that I didn’t recognize until that point. From that point moving forward, the more people I talk to, the more I realize that they weren’t on the platform, or they were and they weren’t finding success. I was able to very quickly carve my little niche in that space and really elevate through the ranks to where we are today.

Marketing at its core is really nothing more than creating preeminent positioning in your marketplace. Click To Tweet

Would you say that it was right place, right time and maybe you were a little bit ahead of the curve from a technology standpoint and people might say that’s what gave you an advantage, or would you say that it was just you actually making a decision to invest more energy and resources and focus to a specialization?

Some of it had to do a little bit with dumb luck, but the other part of it is most definitely an intentional decision to capitalize on a recognized the opportunity. Anybody can do that if they look out into the marketplace. In fact, this is one of the things we teach now. When you look out into your marketplace, the two things any consultant should do is number one, recognize an underserved segment of your marketplace and two, potentially an affluent segment of your marketplace. That’s exactly what I did. I looked out in the marketplace and I understood that there was an opportunity here, because people couldn’t benefit from Facebook ads. Then I said, “What segment of the marketplace is currently being underserved?”At the time, because of my “expertise,” I recognized that the thought leader or the information marketer or the service provider was an underserved segment of the marketplace.

I swooped into that marketplace and I looked for a segment within that that was affluent. People who had great businesses who weren’t struggling in their businesses financially per se, and the combination of finding a segment that was underserved and affluent together allowed me to, as the book says, the Blue Ocean Strategy, move into uncontested space, which then allows you to be the key authority in your space. From there, we’ve grown and expanded and moved on from that. A little bit of dumb luck and a lot of clear intention of recognizing an opportunity, and then applying the skill set and the know-how and the learning and further sharpening the skills to ensure that I stayed in number one place.

What’s a good way then for people to find those underserved markets? People are going, “That makes a lot of sense. I could see that I should be doing that.”How do they actually do it? How does someone go about finding an underserved market, or in your experience, what’s the best way to approach that?

It was tricky explaining how it was done because I live, eat, and breathe this stuff. My fingers were clearly on the pulse of the industry and I recognized that there were the thought leaders. I was, at that time, trying to be a thought leader, so I knew the space. I knew what people were saying. I knew the pain points. It was very easy for me to look into the industry that I was already a part of to understand, “That segment right there is currently not having their needs met.”The big hoopla when Facebook ads first came out were people selling t- shirts. Everybody was selling t-shirts and making gazillion dollars doing so, and t-shirts this, t-shirts that. Everybody was teaching people how to sell t-shirts., I’m like, “I don’t know how to sell t-shirts, but I do know that there’s this great need amongst people like myself who want to be thought leaders, who want to be authority figures in their marketplace, who have information and/or consulting practices. Just because I was in it, I lived it, I breathe it, and I identified it, I was able to speak the same language, connect with the pain points and the problems, and provide a very specific solution to them.

If someone didn’t have their finger on the pulse to that degree, what suggestion might you offer them?

I have found that most often, people who are in the consulting space are consultants because they are in one way, shape, or form scratching their own itch. There was a solution that they can’t find or help that they were looking for that they couldn’t get the help for, so they moved into that space. Or they had a very positive experience of their skill set, helping someone in that space and then being able to elevate it. For the sake of ease, rather than trying to search outside your networks or search outside your own area of expertise, is to tap into the network. Tap into the industry that you’re already a part of and begin to identify are there certain segments that are underserved, and if you’ve already worked with people. One of the things I love to ask is, “Of all the people you’ve ever worked with, who have been your absolute best, hands down, favorite client?”Put that together on a list and then ask, what are the commonalities about them? Is it an industry thing? Is it the size of their business? Is it the type of products or services that they sell? What are the commonalities amongst all the favorite people I’ve ever worked with? Simultaneously, what are the commonalities of all the things of the clients that I hated working with? Even by starting to draw those distinct lines, you can begin to get a clear idea of who it is that you can serve and who you can serve best. There’s two ways of finding an underserved segment of your marketplace or rising up as a key opinion leader or thought leader in that space. One is to find an actual underserved market place. Two is to position what you do in such a way that is unique from all of your competitors. That then also makes you a leader in your space without any competition. Even if you have trouble finding a particular underserved segment, I still think there’s a way to reposition yourself in such a way where people see you as the only person who does what you do because of how you’ve talked about it, word it, or positioned it.

These days, there’s many Facebook ad consultants. Probably everyone sees ads everyone for them and lots of people making claims. You are one of the best in the world from what I’ve heard and seen, that’s why I want to have you come on here. How do you go about separating yourself from the pack? There are many consultants, whether they’re in a specific area of management consulting or they’re in healthcare consulting. Even the ones that have a clear specialization, there’s still competition. You’re in a market where there’s clearly a lot of competition as well, yet your business thrives. What have you done to continue to allow your business to thrive?

I believe marketing at its core is really nothing more than creating preeminent positioning in your marketplace, and then be continuing to reinforce that positioning that you already have. In short, I’m hands down, without any question, bar none results will speak for themselves. If what you’re doing is generating true, tangible, measurable, shareable, achievable results, then you have the ability to leverage those experiences to say, “This is what I did for so and so. This is what I can do for you.” Without anything, result is key. Once you have those results, the second thing comes down to positioning. How then do you position those results to allow what you do to appear to be, and is in fact actually in delivery, very different from what everybody else does? I’ll tell you what I did, for example. Besides association and affiliations, which are key in positioning, who you associate with or what you associate with and what you are affiliated with is a very key element to borrowed positioning as you’re working your way up. For me it was this. I would look out on the marketplace and I saw a lot of great Facebook strategists out there, and 99.9999%of them focused on what I would call tactics or technical elements of Facebook ads. They were really good at teaching someone this is the button you push in Power Editor to set up an ad, this is the conversion mechanism you want to choose, and this is how to bid, and this is how to do all that. I’m not taking away from any of that, and that is super important and I could teach that all day long to anyone who’s interested. The reality is, tactics only go so far. Because I noticed that everybody was talking tactically and technically, I decided my skill set was much more on the strategic nuanced side of it. I learned this lesson from the Beachbody guys and P90X, and a concept that David Ogilvy calls the big idea, but I just call it preeminent positioning.


Ogilvy said there’s three ways to enter into a market place. Number one, through your promise. Your promise is essentially, “I promise is to help you accomplish, blank.” If you’re a consultant on relationships, if you’re a consultant on finances, if you’re a consultant on human resources and building team, your promise is, “I will show you how to have a better HR department. I will show you how to hire people better.” That’s the promise. Not bad. The problem is everybody leads with the promise, everybody talks about the promise, so it puts you in a red ocean with high competition. Your promise has to somehow be better than the other person’s, and frankly it isn’t. The person who says, “I will help you lose weight,” is really no different than the other person who says, “I will help you lose weight.”

The second way you can enter into a market place is Ogilvy calls positioning. Positioning is both your status in the marketplace as well as the position you take in the marketplace. A great example of that is someone can be very counter-cultural to the general understandings of the marketplace. If we’re using P90X as an example of this, or Beachbody as an example of this, their big promise could have been, “We’re going to show you how to lose weight and get ripped.” It’s what everybody else was saying. Now their positioning was a little bit interesting in that when everybody at that time was talking about a really easy diet and a really easy work out, these guys came to the scene like, “This is a workout for bad asses. You’ve got to work 90 minutes a day every single day for 90 days straight if you want results.” It was counter-positioning, but even that wouldn’t have made them the billion-dollar company or the hundred-million-dollar product that P90X was.

CSP 013 | Facebook Consulting

The third level is what Ogilvy calls the big idea and I’ve reframed that and called it the pre-eminent idea. It’s what you throw out into the marketplace that the marketplace can gravitate towards and capture and hold on to that sets you apart from everybody else. In P90X’s case or Beachbody’s case, they had two words that were their big idea that revolutionized their marketplace and turned them into a billion-dollar business. The two words were muscle confusion. Now on the surface, what the hell does that even mean? Nothing. In actuality, the whole thing was everybody knew about muscle memory, and their whole big shtick was, “Your body’s smart and intelligent. If you do the same workout every day, your body’s going to catch up to it, it’s going to know exactly what you’re doing, and all of your progress is going to slow down.”The only way to increase your metabolism and keeping it revving all the time is to create muscle confusion. How do we do that? A new work out, a different workout every single day for 90 days straight, and here are the results. Those two words or that phrase was what revolutionized their business. I saw that and I said, “My big promise is I can help you generate more leads, more clients, and more customers using Facebook ads.” It’s not very different from everybody else.

My positioning was I do this from a strategic standpoint, which is far more effective than just the tactical standpoint, which set me a little bit apart from everybody else, but my pre-eminent idea was what I call contextual congruence. What does that mean? Absolutely nothing. But what does it mean? Absolutely everything. The concept that I put out there was, “If you want to really make Facebook ads work for your business, you have to be congruent to the context of the platform that you’re on.” I built this entire narrative around that, which is true by the way, but this is what I lead with in the marketplace. This is how you know it’s working. It’s when people come back to you and say, “Nick, can you review my ads? I know they’re not exactly contextual congruent, but I want you to take a look anyways.” They didn’t even know what that word meant, but they were speaking back the phraseology that we’re throwing back out into the marketplace. That is where consultants can start to realize, know what your promise is, know what your position is in the marketplace, and hopefully you have a contrarian positioning or a little bit of a different angle, but most definitely start to get very clear on what it is that is unique to you. What is your pre-eminent idea that you could lead with in the marketplace? All of a sudden you are now in a category of one and that, plus results, plus affiliations and associations, definitely puts you leaps above everybody else in your marketplace.

Your business has been growing. As you continue to work to grow it, what does success mean to you? What are you keeping in mind on a daily basis in terms of what you’re working towards and just staying happy about what you’re doing? What is success to you?

Know what your promise is, know what your position is in the marketplace and start to get very clear on what it is that is unique to you. Click To Tweet

That definition has changed over the years. When I first started, success was connected to a dollar amount, and that was probably not right at the time. I got into the business to build a business that revolved around my lifestyle, rather than a lifestyle that revolved around my business. If someone is not careful, you can very easily get those two mixed up, and all of a sudden your business is taking over and the lifestyle that you once wanted and desired to have is completely gone the other way, and now you’re just focusing on that. When my wife and I started, because she is now a partner in the business, our first measure of success was dollar amounts. It was the million-dollar business, and then it was the $10 million business, and then it was the $50 million business. As we started to hit those milestones, all of a sudden it’s like, “Where do you draw into that line?” I had to take a serious question, and take a few steps back to ask the question, “To what end? When was enough, enough?” We had to ask ourselves, “Why are we really in this? Is it to peacock to our friends? Is it to own all this nice stuff which, once we owned it, all of a sudden wasn’t all that nice anymore? What was it?”We said, “It had to get back to the lifestyle side.” Then we had our first child and our definition of success changed even further. Now it wasn’t just about lifestyle, it was about being good parents. How can we be home for our child? How can we take care of her and provide her the lifestyle that she needs? Now, with our second child, that changes a whole another dynamic. The long and short of it is we are constantly being reminded of what is important to us or we have to be intentional about that reminding. Now our definition is simply, “Do we have enough of what we need to live the lifestyle that we desire, and be the parents that we want to be to our kids?” If the answer is yes to that within perspective, I believe we’ve achieved success and now our goal isn’t only up into the right. It isn’t just this massive growth trajectory.

Derek Sivers came up with this concept that I find is beautiful, and I’m now able to implement it. He says, “If any decision comes across your path or any opportunity comes your path that’s not a fuck yeah, then it’s got to be a hell no.”For the longest time that sounds like great vernacular, but for the longest time I was saying yes to, “Yeah, I think that’s good,” because of the potential monetary benefit or the potential status benefit. Now, we are truly living in a place and this is our new definition of success, is that we’re only doing ‘fuck yeah’ things in our life and in our business. That tells me that we’re on the path towards where we want to be and where we’re going.

CSP 013 | Facebook Consulting

I remember you posted about that decision to not just keep scaling the business bigger and bigger. Now with what you’re sharing, there’s a lot more context to that. Specifically, what changes did you make in your business? Did you go to fewer team members? Did you choose to say no to specific types or size of clients? What did you specifically do to optimize your business so that it better aligned with what success means to you and to your wife and to your family? What does that actually look like and what does it look like today?

The answer is all of the above. I don’t like to say scaling down. That’s what I used to call it, until I had a conversation with my friend. I was explaining what I was doing and he goes, “Actually, Nick, that’s not scaling down, that’s netting up.”I use that term but I give him credit all the time. Netting up to me meant a couple of things. Number one, clearly identifying only the clients that we like to work with, whether on the consultancy side or the agency side. Our new criteria is not just that you have a great business and you’ll pay us a ton of money to do what we do, but would I actually be willing to have dinner with you one night or even go on vacation with you? If the answer is yes and you’re that type of a person, then you’re a hell yes and we’ll have business together. Joe Polish says, “Life is too short to work with assholes.”I don’t mean that to be offensive, but there are people that I’ve worked with who are assholes and it just wasn’t fun. That’s one thing. It’s being clear on who the clients are. Secondly, it was increasing our prices. Everybody, especially when you’re starting out, goes through this mental shift of “am I worth charging this x number of dollars?”You’ll get there, and you raise your fees a little bit. I’m not saying arbitrarily raise your fees for the sake raising them, but I’m saying I’m raising them to create the business and the lifestyle and the clients that you really want to work with.

The other aspect was yes, reducing the number of clients, but also increasing our costs. On a very practical standpoint, was to let go of all of our full time staff. We carried staff and we built our agency up to a decent amount at some point, and then all of a sudden I felt the burden of being now a CEO or a manager and being responsible for all of these people, and I don’t have what it takes to be a CEO. It’s not in my DNA. I’m not like an entrepreneur in that sense. We had to let go of all of our full time staff, which meant we identified key responsibilities, key roles, and key gaps in our business, and we put contractors in place for that. People who are really good at what they did, we weren’t their only clients in most cases. Hiring contractors to fill those gaps was a huge burden off our shoulders. Fifthly, putting SOP’s in place. When I first started as an entrepreneur, I was literally flying by the seat of my pants. I was like, “Let’s do this and let’s do this.”There were no real key standard operating procedures to how to on-board a client, how to take care of that client, what to do with them, all of that stuff. None of that existed. We invested with working with someone to come into our business, analyze the entire thing, work with us that way, and then develop standard operating procedures for everything. All of a sudden, as much as we could either automate or optimize or delegate, became automate, optimize, and delegate.

Lastly, just be intentional about the rules that we set for ourselves. What I mean by that is what hours are we going to work and what hours are we not? I’m not saying being lazy, I’m just saying being clear about this is on time, this is off time. Do we work on the weekends? Do we take calls on Friday afternoon past 4:00 PM or not? By clearly defining some of those boundaries, that heavily lifted some burdens off our shoulders. Now we don’t take calls on the weekend, now at a certain time, we don’t work. Now we know that X time is dedicated for us taking the kid to the park and playing and not having our cell phones with us. A combination of all those things really helped to alleviate some of the burdens and the feelings, and also allow us to be far more productive from an operational standpoint to still service the people we want to serve but without bending our own rules and building a machine that we’re just not happy to be a part of.

If any decision comes across your path or any opportunity comes your path that's not a fuck yeah, then it's got to be a hell no. Click To Tweet

Nick, you mentioned pricing, that your prices have increased, you’re very selective in terms of the types of clients that you work with. What pricing model are you using now and how has that evolved over time?

When we first started, we had an agency model that was a flat fee. It would cost $4,000 a month to work with us on a fully-managed system. As we started to get amazing results and our client roster filled up and we realized that people wanted to continue to work with us, that went to $6,500 to $7,500 to $10,000 to$12,500 and it kept going. We basically stopped it at $12,500 to say, “Maybe this is not the best pricing model.” Then we also decided that because of the types of clients that we like to work with now, most of these are high growth companies, if we can come in and provide further greater growth for them, it’s an upside for everybody. We then transitioned our pricing model into a performance-based percentage of gross revenue that we were responsible for. The better we do for somebody, the more money they make and the more money we make. Now, rather than the $12,500 that we might have collected from a client, it’s now like $50,000, $60,000 or $70,000 a month because we’re in where everyone’s winning. It’s a performance-driven type model. That’s where we are on the agency side of it.

On the consultancy side of it, we have a couple of models within the consultancy side. Again, if I can have skin in the game where I’m in a performance-based model, a percentage of gross sales as attributed by the work together, that is what we lead with. If not, it’s time blocks. Right now it’s $20,000 for an eight-hour consulting block with me. That can be divided into live or virtual, that can be divided into one six-hour block dedicated and then two-hour follow-up blocks, or eight one-hour blocks spread out whenever someone needs it. That’s essentially where our pricing model is between our consultancy and our agency right now.

You went from $12,500 per month to something now potentially being worth $50,000 or $60,000 per month. It sounds like overall, without necessarily having to spend more time, just optimizing your approach to fees and really being able to provide your clients with results has increased your company’s revenue significantly.

It’s done in such a way where it’s not arbitrarily raising fees for the sake of raising them. It’s designing a win-win scenario for everybody involved. In this case, it actually works great for the client because they know that I’ve got skin in the game and I’m incentivized to do well. I benefit because I’m incentivized. The better I do, the more I get paid. It creates this beautiful ecosystem of win-win and accountability, which is lacking oftentimes in the agency and the consulting world where, “Just pay me a fee and I’ll take care of this. If you don’t get a result, well, too bad, it’s your fault.”In this case, there’s true transparency and accountability that’s above the board for everybody. It’s grown our business from a revenue standpoint, it has created clients who want to be with us longer and are far happier because everybody’s winning from the structure.

What’s the minimum criteria that a company needs to have in order to be a fit for working with you right now?

I don’t know if it’s so much criteria as much as any engagement starts with me performing a marketing audit of the business. I take a quick look at what do they have in process, what is currently in place, and then based on doing that audit, if I feel that I could come in and exponentially get better results than they’re currently getting, I will outline what those results are to them and how I would go about doing that, and then we would potentially engage. If I look at something and I say, “Based on what I see here, there’s nothing I can do.” Either they’ve tapped out, or their processes are broken in a way that I can’t help, or they lied about their numbers, which happens often times. I’ll have a conversation with someone and say, “For us to get started, I need to take a look at your numbers.”They say, “We’re doing X number of revenue and we have X number of clients,” then upon an audit you see that that’s not even close to the case. We’re looking at do they have processes in place that work and can be improved by us helping them. If the answer is yes to both, and of course not without saying they have a legitimate business and it’s not in an industry that’s hurting people or anything like that, then we will most likely get involved with them.

CSP 013 | Facebook Consulting

It’s a great share because the whole idea of client selection and just being very clear around what do you need to do and what to look for in order for it to be a win-win for both parties, so you can really say no to a lot of opportunities and be able to say yes to the right ones is a very important one that not enough people really give thought to.

It’s not easy. A lot of times, especially when you’re growing your business, it’s not easy to turn away business where you know you might be able to help them out, and in the “might” is going to be a paycheck for doing so, but the long term ramifications of that just hurts. It’s just not worth taking on a client for a short term, small windfall, knowing that in the end your reputation could be burned in the process or any one of those negative things happen. I would encourage people, as hard as it is, and I know because I go through it every day. We’ve literally given away and turned down millions and millions of dollars just because I knew we couldn’t help them perfectly. We could’ve helped them a little bit, but we couldn’t help them perfectly. It hurts on the surface, but in the long term it just works out much better that way.

You published a book recently called Give. Your business is going well. You don’t need to publish a book. Why did you publish that book? What was the real goal behind that? Secondly, what has been the impact of the book to your business?  

I was convinced that it was a good thing to do for my business. Someone told me every credible person is an author of a book. I thought, “It seems reasonable to me. Let’s go after this endeavor.”It was a long, unpleasant, pulling-teeth year-long process of my life, and I did it the easy way. What I mean by that, I had a great team around me who was curating content that I already had and great editors and great teams who did most of the work, and yet I still felt like I had a kidney stone that I was passing for the entire duration of the year. I did it because someone told me it was a good thing to do and everybody needed it. Because I did it then I said, well, let’s try to make the most of it and let’s try and hit the Wall Street Journal bestsellers lists because at least then I could leverage the title. I can say, “I’m a Wall Street Journal bestseller.” Unfortunately, we fell short of that goal. It was the just the wrong week to release a book because some heavy-hitters came out that week. It rubbed salt in the wound. You spend all this time, money, energy, and effort to write the book. You don’t hit the list that was the only one that was important to you for writing the book.

On the positive side, it’s gotten into the hands of people who may have never gotten access to me or my work. I get photos every single day of people in the villages of Cambodia reading the book. I don’t even know how they got the bloody book. I’ve seen people in fitness gyms on their treadmill reading the book. I’ve seen cool stories of someone on a flight flying home reading the book, and the person beside them says, “Do you know Nicholas? I’m part of his Facebook group.”From a financial business development standpoint, it’s too early to tell. The book’s only been out and it’s making its rounds, and almost 10,000 books have been sold total. I’m waiting for that one day the CMO of Google to say, “I read your book and we’d love to give you $3 million consulting deal.”That hasn’t happened, and hopefully it will, but who knows. The ramifications so far and the benefits to it haven’t really shown themselves, but the saving grace is that people are reading it. They’re saying they’re loving it. People who may have never been able to afford one of our programs or get access to any one of our trainings or anything like that have this book in hand and it’s benefiting some people’s businesses. That’s been the good side of it.

The better we do for somebody, the more money they make and the more money we make. Click To Tweet

Nicholas, I want to thank you very much for coming on and sharing here today. What’s the best way for people to learn more about your work and to connect with you?  

You could get a free copy of my book, Give, at GiveBook.Info. You just cover the shipping and handling and we’ll send that right out to you. That’s an introductory to my world. If you like the book, it’ll show you how you can come to our website at It’ll show you various different ways when you’re ready that you could work with us. That’s the best and the most cost-effective way to get familiar with my work and to get some benefit from it without even having to invest much to do so.

Thanks again, Nicholas.  

Thank you, Michael. The pleasure was all mine.

Mentioned in This Episode:

Nicholas Kusmich
Blue Ocean Strategy: How to Create Uncontested Market Space and Make Competition Irrelevant, by W. Chan Kim and Renee Mauborgne
Give: The Ultimate Guide to Using Facebook Advertising to Generate More Leads, More Clients, and Massive ROI by Nicholas Kusmich

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